All the proof on the balance of the golden CL18s in a video (battle starts at 9:45): Note: Burke's "Blue Ghost" is a lvl 120 battleship with master crew. Holdinmonsta's Iowa is (i think) 1 star crew, my Bismark 3 star except for the captain that is still 2 star, Ibbsky's Gamelin veteran crew, Slone's sub vet crew... you get the picture - a formidable fleet

With the Andrea Doria given as a bonus I don't have my expectations high for Italian/French fleets anymore. More like: "we have designed these ships to extend the game, it won't happen so you can have them as bonuses instead". expect Dunkerque next or something

Yes, could be a solution and would even allow uneven numbers to even battles but... a. Considering that this same problem applies to online battles balance and it isn't resolved there I don't expect it to be resolved in wof as well. b. you said it: Possible solutions: a. Build a statistical tool to calculate the "strength value" of each ship based on performance in online battles, taking into consideration the crew xp and upgrades as you said. b. close ears and sing "La la la" - this requires some commitment by the devs and usage of objective tools like suggestion a. above. I find the b. issue more critical as it may drive some very active (and paying) players away.

I think it's time to change the war of fleets system to better reflect what fleets actually try to do. Fleets should be able to setup specific battles with options for min/max No of ships, max No of ships of each class and max ship level cap. For example: players 4-7, DD up to 7, CL up to 7, CA up to 5, BB up to 2, CV up to 1, SS up to 2, Max ship level 70. Challenging fleet should be able to further restrict rules to reflect their abilities. For the above example they may reduce players to 5 and ship level cap to 41 excluding all BBs, CVs, SSs and lvl 50 DDs. At that point leader/officer of first fleet should decide which players to drop from his fleet. Option A: In order to keep some variety, putting up one of BB, CV, SS could also put lower limit of other high classes to 1 (not 0) or, Option B: treat BB, CV and SS as a group with a common max No. This way we may again see fleets put up for battle and waiting for battle instead of trying to pick and set a fight in global chat. Before the fight starts (e.g. at 30sec countdown) every participating player (abandoning any other action at the time - see relative thread "wof countdown") should be taken to a war of fleets screen to pick their ship. I would prefer the basic idea, without any of the options (A or B) but anything will be better than the current system.

Also, welcome to the forums 1diddy. happy to see committed players here.

I guess the devs could easily put a restriction like max 1 fleet join in 24 hours and 3 in a week (for example) - and even lower for higher level players.

Alta, while it makes sense from the description I find it highly improbable for this to be the case as it is nearly impossible to get the ratio required given that you are assigned in random to a side in battle and with many good players in the chances of win are not that far from 50%. Could be the case though if the counter resets every day - then it's more of a lottery and there are chances for the achievement to happen.

didn't know that. thanks

Yes, that is the idea. To fix into rules the "unwritten wof protocols". That way no-one will be afraid of leaving the fleet active as any battle will happen within the chosen parameters. More wof - everybody wins. Even more appropriate now with new players and teams joining the game in waves. A new fleet could be active for DD/CL up to lvl 8 battle for example.

Nice read, good advice. Thanks for sharing. Didn't know much about IJN as I've not played them (yet), so it was very insightful.

There is a suggestion to fix the ship selection system as it is a mess now. Please check and comment, the more attention it gets the more likely it is to be implemented sometime.

No way to sell a ship as far as I know. Would be a useful feature to add in the future.

No Sec guns on the DD, it's guns and torps/HH and you need both (after maxing engines). For the fast CL I've witnessed them shoot down squadrons of bombers (probably their only vulnerability) so I guess sec guns are also useful. Also as they don't have much anti-sub capability other than the sonar, if they don't have AA capability their usefulness in the fleet is affected. Also see the Shimakaze thread for DD50 setup tips.

exactly, act your role in the fleet, think what is best for the fleet - not you. Never mind damage totals or kill numbers. Do what is needed for your side to win the battle even if that means playing a support role (what DDs, CLs and CVs* are meant to do anyway). *partially. CVs have the duty to control the skies - including shooting down scouts - and killing capital ships.

Shhh! that's how I get 100k damage with my BBs. Jokes aside and in addition to what Davmak said, NEVER point your bow/stern at a ship firing its guns at you, you present a much bigger target. Always approach/retreat at an angle, use that extra speed as soon as you suspect you are targeted and manoeuvre hard to throw off any manual aim attempts. Don't even try to go close enough to a BB to fire your torps/HHs unless you are in a coordinated gang (expect some losses there) or your target is preoccupied with another battle (this includes sacrificing your DD to save an allied BB - if your target turns its guns on you it doesn't hit an allied BB) AND no SS or CV is a plausible threat to your allies. You may fire torps with intend to force the enemy to manoeuvre/alter course if it suits the broader strategy. The strength of DDs and CLs is in anti-sub, anti aircraft warfare and hunting unprotected CVs, CAs and BBs are quite vulnerable by subs and planes but very strong vs small ships. Work with your fleet, preserve your boat, shield your capital ships from the threats. I would even suggest to avoid battle with other DDs and CLs unless: a) they try to gang up your capital ships (a salvo of torps can do the trick), b) to protect a submarine ally, c) you are confident you are much stronger eg. CL18 vs DD1/3 and d) there are no strong allies left.

Hold the depth control button pressed, it will move the check to the bottom of the dial and your sub will deep dive. It cannot move or fire torps (other than go to shallow depth or surface) but will be invulnerable to torps and hedgehogs and will disappear from sonar (your sonar will still work). Some players use that to ambush ships or other subs. As you have to keep the dial pressed the deep dive is a bit slow and you can easily surface instead if you don't hold on long enough.

Nice work and a good read. As I despise HA my answers/comments are based on battle requirements/tips/tactics only. I have to agree that the lvl 1 DD is only useful to take you to lvl 3. I can only answer for Kriegsmarine as it's the only nation I'm high level for BB, SS and CV. The BB Gneisenau is only slightly more powerful than the Hipper (CA41) so I agree there. I tried the CV next but was so frustrated at it that I gave up and built the SS to play instead. I enjoyed it, yes it is flimsy, but I think the SS is much more dependent on player skill than any other ship in the game short Oxy endurance is a hard limitation with inexperienced crew but still there is joy in attacking and sinking powerful ships from the very beginning. Can't sing a song nice enough for the Kitakami. That ship is so nice it borders on OP. With a skillful captain I have witnessed it win many battles (including War of Fleets where it pwned 2-3 subs and kept the stronger ships at bay destroying any tactics they tried). Bayern, Texas and the other tiny, fast CLs I despise, only because I never got one and have suffered a lot from them. They pack a respectable punch and are small and fast enough to be almost unhittable at any range except point blank. Not only excellent fleet disorganisers and CV hunters but given time and space to manoeuvre they can get ANY ship. Definitely OP.

Developers: At least the low graphics option should be free of all bells and whistles. I really loved it six months ago even with 12 vs 12 online battles, it's been getting worse since.

Yes there is. Keeping enemy scouts down gives your allies the ability to manoeuvre undetected and engage enemies out of their view, forcing them to get closer while manual firing at approximate positions. You can achieve this with just one squad of fighters and pound them with the rest. Rush in where if they don't see you? Also, yes please, point your bow and only half your guns to my broadside. I'll get 100% hits with 100% of my firepower while the enemy rushing in will get <50% hits (when visible much less if he doesn't see me) from 50-66% of his guns.

Yes, if every ship doesn't play it's role correctly the battle is lost - or just chaotic at best. I don't bother with scouts early in battle, relying in others to scout instead.

Manual AA guns only shoot at altitude - you have to predict the position of planes to shoot them down. There seems to be an auto AA that only targets very close to the ship low flying planes when they dive for their torp run or to drop their bombs. You won't see any guns firing from the ship just random planes being shot down. In conclusion: "Long" range high altitude AA Manual only, short range low altitude AA auto only (same on all ships not "enabled" small guns only).

Don't know about IJN, I found Gneisenau (German BB50) to be a little more powerful than the Hipper (CA41) and a shell magnet (just because of the BB before the name) but overall I was satisfied leveling it. I have almost given up on my CV55, but I think that's more my fault being hopeless trying to control 3 squads of planes and a ship at the other side of map efficiently. If you believe your side will win, stay to the end of battle after you get sunk to get the 15 crew xp. Unfortunately BBs, SSs and CVs take ages to grind to veteran crew - not much to do there if you don't want to buy expert crews with gold. SS is a different story: Respectable damage from green crew, everything happens on screen (without much scrolling around). Just keep an eye on oxygen and learn to deep dive fast as the control is a bit unwieldy.

Try staying close to a capital ship and support. The battleship should take care of any surface threats, you take care of airborne and subs. Most likely you will not do the damage amount you did in 'torp and die' but you will have a serious contribution to the battle. Unlike Neuner I have the Z121 with 3 gun, no AA but more than a match for any DD and CL, many CAs and green BBs. Can do serious damage (50-80k similar to my battleships) if I don't get overexcited and go too close to a battleship. Also see "So you are now lv 50 with 1 mil steel" for more. SS count normally as any other vessel. Planes are not displayed in the damage counter up left but I'm sure they count towards the damage score in the battle report at the end. For me the ultimate bonus is winning the battle and getting the 15xp for my crew. PS. If you like torpedoes Kitakami is the undisputed champion.

My build on the Z121 (German lvl 50 DD) is with hedgehogs. I keep my distance (close to my max gun range) from CAs and BBs relying in speed and manoevrability to stay alive and actively hunt subs and CVs given the chance. I disagree on the beginner battle part. DD50 has it's place in great battle and online battle (as sub screen and AA in front of the capital ships). Also 63kn? is that with master crew?

Ok, I'm convinced. HA is a feature that appeals to players (maybe I'll give it a try sometime). Is there a way to redact my suggestion?